"Should He Walk Away From His $1.4M Business To Start Over?" | Alex Hormozi Answers Live

Hey, Alex. I'm Michael. Nice to meet you. >> What's up, Michael? How's it going, man? >> Doing well. So, I run a consulting firm here in Vegas that implements project management software for enterprise ops and PMO teams >> Okay. >> with Fortune 500 clients. We're at 1.4 million tracking towards 2 million. We're demand constrained because almost all of our pipeline comes through software vendor referrals in a subcontractor relationship. However, I've built some serious AI enablement in the business over the last 12 to 18 months. And generally, feel I'm ahead of most consultants in the space. My concern is the avatar's fuzzy, but I'm a top 1% architect of the software. You're going to roast me for it, but considering a brand new business with my wife with a crystal clear avatar in healthcare. And so, my question is how do I know if a clear avatar is worth walking away from a business I think I already know how to run. >> Um I'm I'm okay with you burning the boats. I am less okay with the trying to serve two masters or ride two horses with one ass. Um and so, if you really, really feel confident about it, then I would encourage you to go all in. Um and I think the way to do that would be just get your first customer from the new stream from a channel that is reliable. And so, that would mean like it's either going to be an outbound method or an ad space motion that you're probably going to run. It could be an affiliate motion as well if you like know two or three, call it influencers or coaches in the space who help healthcare businesses. That'd be a great first place to go if you wanted to have like a speed to money. Um but I think you'd have to pick one of those three business models. I understand the difficulty of the enterprise play. It's mostly just that the sales cycle so long. I'm going to guess how many clients do you have right now? >> About 12. >> Yeah, I think you're also just wildly underpriced on the enterprise side. So, it makes sense that it it makes sense that you wouldn't want to charge SMB prices and go through a Fortune 500 sales process. Does that make sense? >> Yeah, for sure. Part of it is we when we go direct, we have like a killer offer model thanks to your books, and like that does 83% margins, but because of the referral subcontractor relationship, we're capped at hourly, which is killing us to like 17% margin. So, we're trying to move away from it. >> Yeah, that's >> The avatar in Yeah, the avatar in that space though is like, do you use the software? Yes, cool. No, okay, let me explain what it is. It's not really industry or vertical based, which is our our struggle. >> Dude, I'm I'm all I'm all good with the healthcare thing. My my biggest thing on that side is you should be able to directly go acquire a customer. So, what size healthcare providers are you looking for? >> I'd say it's probably private practice physicians. >> I think you'll I think you'll print. It's very easy to get to sell to those customers. Like, almost every motion works for them because they're business owners, they typically prefer done-for-you solutions because they don't like doing things besides their practice, and they're they're very hours constrained because they literally like make money by trading their time. Um and so, but it's it's TLDR, I'm good with the move. My my only counsel here is that you go all in on it if you really feel confident. So, do you have savings saved up? >> We do. So, part of it is we have like multi-year contracts in the current business, and some of it is just like pass-through reseller transactions that we do. So, we do have a cushion. So, I guess like the follow-up would be what would because it's a time investment, we have two little kids, and just making sure that we're keeping the current business afloat enough while the two kind of, you know, switch off essentially from the primary. >> Well, so the afloat enough part is the part that I don't like, which is what are the things that you have of that business are passive versus what are the things that are still active? I would say be willing to cut out the active to the degree you can. And also, those contracts are ongoing, but you can cancel them on your side whenever you want. And so, it feels like the appearance of being stuck, but you could stop it whenever. Unless Did they prepay? >> Uh so, it's In most cases, it's like 3-year deals, and they pay annually. And again, part of it's through the subcontractor relationship, so we're just getting like a commission check in some of those cases. >> again, so just separate out what's the stuff that I'm doing work for, what's the stuff that I'm just being, you know, a sub, you know, override on, um to the degree possible. Basically, what I'm trying to go for here is I'm trying to minimize your workload. Because to say I'm going to keep this business going and then also start this other business, I think it's the recipe. Like, that is the recipe for pain and failure. Um and it's what everyone wants to do. And so, I think that if you could clear your calendar the like basically, you'll maximize the likelihood that you're going to be successful in this new endeavor if you have all your resources deployed towards it. And I'll give you a different frame on this, which is that like your downside protection of like I want to make sure I'm paying my bills might come at the expense of 2 years of growth. So, like you might be able to grow basically what would be your year two if you went all in might be your year four with the quote downside protection because of split attention. That again assumes that you're going to be successful, which might not be true because you're not going to be able to fully allocate time towards it. And so, if anything, maybe I'd prefer your wife stays behind, fully does that one, and then you can go uh and start the healthcare thing. But, I do not like split focus. It's just very hard to win because you're competing against people who are fully all in. >> Yeah, she would most likely be the brand authority. She's a nurse, she's way more impressive than I am, and would be a better brand authority in in that space. I'd be more of the technical operator. >> Yeah, but you like Do you get my cuz this is what you're saying is I want to start this new thing, but I have this other thing, and this other thing is still full-time right now, but I want to add to my plate because I think this other thing's better. If you think the other thing's better, then like do the other thing. >> Yeah, no, totally makes sense. I think what's what's tough for me is that the current business just got to a place where we're no longer founder dependent on delivery. So I can go focus on marketing and sales. And I think for me, my biggest constraint is I need to like I don't care about earning for the next 5 to 10 years. I need to develop marketing and sales skills. And so what I don't want to do is make the wrong time investment gap because I'm going to have to develop those skills in the new business anyways. I just have to start it all over from scratch to get it to that that level. >> Yeah, I mean you you described the cost of switching. >> Yeah. >> [laughter] >> But it sounds like what you want is affirmation for a decision. Not a problem to solve. >> Yeah, I mean I guess my my fear is being in a top 1% in like one technology skill set with a fuzzy avatar is like okay, can I overcome that avatar gap to get to 10 20 million versus you know what? I'm okay being a top 20 top 30% operator with a very clear avatar that should allow us to scale a lot quicker. And again, it's really the kids is the big thing is that I don't want to make a bet to where it's like oh hey kids, it's just going to be a little bit longer for you know this business to take off. It just feels like starting over is a is a pretty big gamble and I don't want that expense to my kids. >> It is a gamble. And so you ask a question of risk which is entirely personal. >> Yeah. >> So like, you know, let's say I put $300 million into your account tomorrow and then you say hey I'm going to put, you know, a 100 between three different companies and sleep on the couch. I'd be like that's very risky. That's what Elon did. I would probably not counsel most people to do that, but that would have been then we wouldn't have SpaceX and Tesla and everything else. And so like risk is entirely personal. I think that you were looking for more from certainty from a world that will give you none. Um and I wish I could just say like it's all going to be okay, but I've no idea. Um I think it makes sense that selling to an avatar that is easier to target and has a shorter sales cycle uh will be easier to acquire customers. You'll also have to deal with all of the pain in the asses of that specific avatar. >> Yeah, that would make sense and I think that's the big piece I was, you know, uncertain about is the how important is clarity of the avatar to to grow a business. That's >> Extremely. >> Yeah, that's kind of what I figured. >> Yeah. I mean, perfect world is you sell one thing to one person. Uh less than perfect is you sell one thing to lots of people. Uh worst case is you sell everything to everyone. >> Makes sense. >> So right now you sell one thing to a lot of different people. That's the fuzziness, right? >> Yeah. >> And so you're trying to transition to selling one thing to one person, which I think is a good idea. >> Yeah. Cool. Now that that's that's great. Now it's been very helpful. It's uh I I think my big fear hesitation is like I've I've been on a path and honestly it wasn't until the marketing workshop that >> this idea came up and it's like, oh, I think we might want to go all in on this and it's like, do I want to end one road to pursue another uh that you know I've already put a bunch of time and effort in, but no, this has been very helpful. >> Good. I would just I would encourage you whatever your line of comfort is, I would just go past that in terms of what you need to be willing to give up on the other one. Because again, I will say this is my final word before we get to the next caller. Um the idea that you're just going to keep this business and start another business is typically a failing formula. So you like I Here's my tactic for you. Create a plan that gets you out and monitor how many my hours you're going to have in your week by what you remove from the other side. You're not going to just be able to add. You have to remove first. So, think about everything you're going to be able to remove and then with the time that's left over, if you think that you can actually start a business and succeed, then go for it. If you still don't think you can with the amount of time that when you clearly look at how much time every single thing takes, they're going to be able to do it, then you have a decision to make, which is maybe I should just, you know, reinvest in the business that I have and see like is there a world where I could get to 20 million in that business? You sold to Fortune 500 companies. I think it's probably you could. You just aren't charging enough for that level of avatar. >> And I think last thing I'll say, cuz I do want to be respectful of time, is for us, we get through the Fortune 500s through subcontractor relationship, which we don't control. >> And it's very difficult for us to get in direct with an offer that does bring. >> Yeah, you just don't have an acquisition channel. >> Exactly. >> So, instead of starting a new business, you could just start a new acquisition channel in the business you have. That would be a different alternative. All right, appreciate you, man. Just create the plan, figure out how many hours you got, and then make the call. >> Will do. >> All right, thanks, brother. All right, let's see here. What do we got in le chat? I believe that's French for chat. Um Spontane, can you Google that make sure it's French for chat is le chat? Um all right, let's see. Please fix sound to be stereo. It's one person saying that, so I'm not really sure. Don't read the chat, says Nifty. Nifty, maybe I said that correctly. By the way, if you repeat the same question over and over again in the chat, I guarantee you I will not read it. Um Okay, let me see who can just put one up. This is now getting mental. Uh This is hard to read. Can we Can we scroll this one up so that Okay, thank you. Thank you. I appreciate that. Would you recommend getting into a position where you can afford to take risks? You can always afford to take risks. It's just what your downside is because most people overestimate the downside as in they think that they're going to be homeless and not be able to eat food. Most times you can crash at somebody's place, you can live in a bedroom for a couple hundred bucks a month. If you really had to, there's food at homeless shelters. I'm being very extreme here, but we usually catastrophize this idea that that like failure means that we're going to die. But most of the time just means that people who you know that have not taken risks will try to exert their status above you by reminding you that they are better than you in this very narrow slice of life in this very narrow time period for you. And so I would encourage you to ignore them because at the end of the day I think you should ignore all naysayers including yourself because none of them increase the odds that you get what you want. And so if you believe that getting what you want is an important thing, then you shouldn't listen to anyone who tells you that you can't. There's literally no return. All right. Um Let's see here. What else we got? Uh lack of focus is a form of cowardice. You don't believe in yourself enough to go all in. Yeah, that's one of my one of my favorite quotes of my own. >> [laughter] >> Um let's pause somewhere. Just give me one to read. Here we go. Shawn uh Hatfield, career advice. Running sales on pure commission for two companies uh this summer going to senior deciding between big tech sales and building sales firm from post-grad. Um I'll give you a piece of advice, Shawn. I think that you'd be better served trying to find a product that has very low churn, that benefits from outbound sales and taking your sales experience instead of thinking, oh I know how to sell, I'll either sell for somebody or I'll create a sales firm. Just go find a product to sell. There's a lot of different products that are out there that you don't have to like build, right? Um you can get into insurance. You can get into you know you can get into banking. You can get into uh M&A. You can get into recruiting, right? There's lots of different businesses that are kind of sales oriented that have Recruiting doesn't sticky, but the customers were sticky if they're big enough. Um where you can create something that's very valuable with that core skill. Um also, you could sell you could sell pest control, you could sell alarm systems. All of these things are sales-oriented and you just basically, you know, you just go find the product and then install it. Um which is not that complicated of a business to do and you'll get you'll capture a significantly larger portion of the upside than just doing like a sales agency, which I promise you like it's not going to be as good as you think it is. I've yet to see any sales agency get above maybe a million a month, and it's just because it's too painful. Right? Anybody who's big enough brings it in house uh because it's too expensive to outsource, and sales is such a core part of the business. You're going to be dealing with minnows who suck at sales, and you're going to want to fix every part of their business, and that's not the business you're going to want to be in. All right. Colin, can I get a pause on this so I can so I can read one of these? All right. Um Someone just pause it for me. There we go. Silas, running private oop uh Well, Silas is a a mystery question. All right, let's go. Moving to whatever. Uh if you were in crippling debt with $20,000 in cash, would you work a sales job to pay off the debt or would you take the risk of starting a business if had the promise of getting out of debt faster? It's an interesting question. Um crippling debt is a very emotionally laden label. Cuz you were willing to tell me how much cash you had, but you weren't willing to tell me how much debt you had. Uh and so, if you had like $100,000 in debt and you had $20,000 in cash, um it's an interesting question cuz it actually cheats the question that I was just answering, which is it's a risk-based question. Like, what is the correct amount of risk to take on? Depends if you win or not, right? Um there's a very strong argument for somebody who says, "Well, is there really a big difference between taking out, you know, a loan for $500,000 versus $400,000 to start this new business? Could I make it work with 400 and then basically get the other 100 that I would pay off, which is my personal debt. Probably. Uh on the other hand, there's probably strong argument for saying like you can just go sell and pay it off. It does depend on how much debt it is and how good your skill set is. Right? And so there's a there's a big fat it depends and both of them are one is on your skill, the second is on your risk tolerance. The true downside is that you file bankruptcy and then your credit gets dinged and then you start from scratch again. So, it's not death if you fail. That is the true worst case. All right. FBA Dimes. Last one and then I'm going to take the next call. If you had one profitable business funding another business My god, this is going to This is such a common question. If you had one profitable business funding another business with much greater exit potential, how would you allocate your time, capital, and tension between them? Dude. Or do that. It's one of the hardest things, man. Everybody Everybody thinks I mean like the call I was just on, right? Is you get into a business, you do it for a while, it doesn't grow as fast as you want, you realize all the crap that's inside of it, and then you think to yourself, given everything I've learned, I thought there's a better business than the one I've got. And then you're like, well, I don't want to start that from scratch cuz this is my cash flow. So, you know, I should take this cash flow to put in this other thing. I will just tell you from experience that the new thing will grow five times faster if you go all in on the new thing than if you try and straddle two. Like it's it's it's it's virtually impossible to run two businesses well. Right? Um And one of the one of the most unfortunate things that I've seen is people are like, well, what about Elon? You're not Elon. You're not. If you were, you would already had an exit for whatever a hundred million dollar thing that it was his first company he was like 24. You're not Elon. Right? The same people like, hey, I'm trying to be like Warren Buffett. I'm like, well, dude, you're 30 and you're buying your first stocks. He bought his first when he was seven. You're not Warren Buffett. Like, hey, I want to get into music. I'm going to be like Mozart. Well, did you write your first concerto at whatever nine? Probably not. Right? And so, it's like some level of self-awareness is useful. Most people cannot be CEO of more than one company. Now, you can own more than one company. Very different. Right? I can own shares in Apple. Not a big deal. I don't run Apple. Right? So, if you if you buy something and it runs and you have an operator, that works. If you are the operator of two businesses, there's just not enough bandwidth. There's too many things going on. And you have to make a call and I think that part of the reason that people who try to split their attention um don't succeed in either is because there's actually a larger character trait that they're lacking, which is decisiveness. Because somebody who's very decisive would be able to make the call and say this is what I'm going to do and then that character trait, that behavior pattern, would repeat throughout the business because that lack of decisiveness also carries through each of those now two businesses that decisions are not made fast enough, they're not made decisively enough and as a result they do not grow. And so, I will tell you this. The speed of the company is based on the speed of decision-making of the boss. I'm going to say that again. The speed of growth in your business is based on the speed of your decision-making. So, it's not like you're going to move faster. It's not like you're going to type faster. You're going to be more erratic. Like, we all have the same number of hours. But, the things that take the longest time in business are the decisions that you delay. That is what is taking your time. And the thing is is that you can do something slowly and you will always get it done faster than somebody who delays the decision to begin with because you can delay and sit in decision for years. And some of you guys are in this situation right now. So, what I would encourage you to do is burn the boats. Like, I have had many different businesses, but what you will notice is that at each of the punctuated periods of transition in my life, I I burn the boats and get rid of the one that I had before. And it's usually because uh I might have started them at the same time, but then they still it they take off when I make when I go all in. So, go all in. All right. Next call. Let's do this. >> Hey Alex, my name is Benjamin. I run an agency. We provide lead generation and SaaS solutions for life-affirming crisis pregnancy centers. Uh so, I know your book helped us create our grand slam offer. We 4x since then, so huge thanks. >> Hell yeah, baby. >> It's helped us reach like thousands more mothers and a lot more babies to alive today because of that. So, congrats on your own baby, too. >> Thank you. >> We we generate uh 2 million per year. Uh plus 550 on the SaaS side. >> Okay. >> Um we want to get to 5 million in 2 years. >> Okay. >> Uh and we're growing consistently, but what's stopping me is that despite everything being healthy and the mission still mattering to me a lot, I have lost the motivation to do the work. >> Mhm. >> So, I've been doing this almost 9 years. I turned 30 on the 18th. Um about a year ago, it started. I've been feeling increasingly jaded. >> Yeah. >> I'm trying to determine whether I'm burnt out, bored, miscast in my role, or just genuinely ready to move on. >> I think so so I I define burnout as the reward that you got for doing the work before either comes now at a greater delay or no longer satisfies the way it did, which means you need to change the variety or intensity of reward. All right? So, you said in plain speak, uh you're not getting out of it what you used to for the same work. Does that sound right? >> Yeah. >> Okay. So, I'll give you two frames to think through this with. Number one is all businesses are the same when you succeed at a high enough level. Which is that if you play this out until it's at 10 million or whatever, you're probably going to have a director of marketing, a director of sales, a director of IT, a director of whatever. And you're just going to be managing those seven people. And the widget or the product that you sell or the service that you sell, it doesn't really matter. I mean, it matters from a like big goal, mission, etc. And that's what you're doing, and that's already fine. But your actual day-to-day is not going to change that materially. The second frame that I would offer um is that I think that you are not thinking big enough. Like you seem like a uh a cogent person. Like you seem like you have relatively clear thinking. Um and so I think that you have higher potential than you have aspirations, at least stated just now. Uh there's nothing cuz when you said I'm at two, you know, whatever, two and a half, I think we get to five in the next 2 years. Like why not get to 10 in in in 12 months, right? Like why not why not think bigger? >> Yeah. >> Like what would it take? >> So it's tough our our TAM we our TAM size limited. I think there's you know, we have about 20% or 15% of the market share. Um there's probably 800 pregnancy centers out there that would qualify for our program. >> Okay. >> And so unless we added like lots more products and services. >> Mhm. >> Um you know, which we could do. So I think part of the problem is like over the last 2 years, well, this isn't a problem. I've delegated a lot. So my team's handling like all the day-to-day. >> Yeah. >> And um so I cleared that up my schedule so I could focus on the things that only the CEO could do. I watched a video on maker versus manager days. I carved out 2 days for just maker activities. >> Love it. >> Uh yeah, it was great video. Um but I've been doing that for about 2 months now and what I've ended up doing is just sitting at my desk and it just feels like there's this psychological barrier just keeping me from doing the work. And that work being like writing content, filming content. This is essentially the I went to the scaling workshop in January and they said, "Yeah, your your problem is you need to be more famous." So I watched the podcast geared Yeah. >> Good. >> Um watched the podcast, it's going well. Um but, you know, I know I'm not a lazy person, but for some reason I feel very lazy when I get in the office. I just don't want to do it. And so my Christian CEO group said, "You need to take a 2-month sabbatical." But I know that that's not going to magically fix it either. >> It means the work itself is no longer rewarding. >> Mhm. >> [clears throat] >> And so to me, what creates reward? What creates reward for me is challenge. And I'm going to put a big one here is stakes. >> Mhm. >> Like right now, you don't have high enough stakes. That's why I'm saying you're not thinking big enough. It's like Like here's my equivalent for you. You started Let's say you're at a blackjack table cuz I'm in Vegas, right? You're at a blackjack table and you have $10,000 saved up. If you're playing $100 hands, like you could lose your entire fortune in in a in a night in Vegas, right? If you're a billionaire and you're playing $100 hands, you make $100 faster than you can even play the hand. It becomes meaningless. And so when billionaires are at the casino, they have to bet with big enough zeros that it actually has real stakes for them. And so the thing is is like I think you've become successful enough that you must raise your stakes. So like you have to make bigger bets. >> That resonates cuz we've been taking on about the same amount of clients like targeting 25 new ones for the last 2 years. We've saved up half a million in the bank and kind of figuring out how do we want to spend this to to grow. >> Yeah. >> Um you know, my So we're hiring like another That's why I didn't ask about In the past it would have been demand is my constraint, but I know you're just going to say do more. So we're hiring another setter cuz we can get more proposals so we can get more clients. >> Good. >> Um but you know, I've I looked at you know, what do I love you know, one of the frameworks for burnout is like it's the wrong type of work. So if you're doing like the menial stuff, you should have delegated and you know, delegate that. So I realized you know, I love negotiating, pitching, communicating, those high-stakes conversations, but the ops, keeping organized, stuff like that, I dread. Is that realistic for me as a CEO to >> 100%. >> How can I get to just doing that? >> Dude, you can do whatever the [ __ ] you want. >> Yeah. >> Dude, it's your business. You can do whatever the [ __ ] you want. There are no rules. So, you like the you like The Offers Book. The first line in that book is there are no rules. Toby from And this goes all the way up. Toby from Shopify, who's the founder, he just works on product. He's not even the CEO. That's all he likes doing. So, that's what he does. >> So, would that mean like trying to hire a COO level? When do you know? Cuz I know you guys didn't do that till way later at your company. When do you know you're ready to just have an ops person to run it? >> It's just I would say this is that you don't want an ops person cuz ops people are rarely the people who can actually run [ __ ] What you want is a leader. And I would prefer you use that language cuz it'll be much more it'll be much closer to the person you actually need. Cuz like right now, people in your company look up to you in some way. They admire elements of who you are. And so, you need someone who people also admire that they will then go to to solve their day-to-day problems. So, it's basically like to me, the the best leaders are excellent decision-makers and excellent with people. And that's what makes somebody who's a quote good operator. And no good operators actually call themselves operators. >> Mhm. >> Just as a little tidbit I've learned from placing operators. >> [laughter] >> They don't call themselves operators. >> So, it could be another visionary type as well. It doesn't have to be just more of a people manager person. >> No, I'm saying the a people manager again, people manager sounds like a manager. I think you want a call it a director and up cuz you you want somebody who the whole team looks up to and then can go to them rather than you so that you can go promote. It sounds like you like winning business. >> Mhm. I do. >> Right. So, it's like right now you're you're a hunter and you're in the farm. And so, you're like, "Dude, farming's boring." It's like, "Yeah, no shit." Especially if you're a hunter. >> Yeah. >> It's like, "Dude, you got to go hunt." Like, you got to go hunt not because the business needs it but because you need it. >> Yeah, so larger deals. >> Yes. Why do you think I did the launch? The $100 million launch. I didn't like there's no like the business that I have makes a shitload of money, right? The portfolio that we have makes a shitload of money. I don't need to do a $100 million launch. I made up a goal cuz I thought it'd be sick. >> Yeah. >> Completely made up. >> I'm trying to find bigger deals. My deals right now are 3K a month and >> Yeah. >> Um I mean these are nonprofit >> Yes. >> crisis pregnancy centers, so it's >> Yeah. >> hard I mean there's definitely a niche within a niche. I could find people who could spend more, but I don't know what to offer them because it feels like I'd be selling uh you know, vanity marketing services. Right now we're heavy on Google Ads, SEO, AEO >> Yeah. >> because that's really where they get the leads from. That's where women go to find info. >> Uh-huh. >> And so I could add all these other marketing things, >> Yeah. >> but I don't have the conviction that it would help, so I'm not sure. >> That's fine. I would rather you just increase the goal of your sales velocity. So I'll tell you I'll tell you I'll I'll give you a little back back uh we call it back door baseball or something like that. Um there's a deal that I'm working on um I I I have to be very careful about what I'm sharing. Um but we have goals for that company, right? And the goals that we have talked about with the, you know, founders of the business have been, "Okay, this is what we're going to do over the next 5 to 7 years." As soon as we agreed on those numbers and we went back and forth cuz there's, you know, there's work involved with both those things on both sides. As soon as I met up with uh my team internally, I was like, "How the [ __ ] we going to do this in 12 months?" And I was like, "And let's reverse the entire model to getting it done in the 12 months." And so that's what we started at. Like what would it take? And so so that's my favorite question in the world. What do I want to have happen? What would it take? And I think that if you look at what it would take, that will start to get you excited because the stakes will go up. Because right now you growing by 20% or 30% 2 years in a row just doesn't mean a lot to you. Cuz the thing is is it changes nothing about your life. So like for a goal to be meaningful, we have to think what happens after I accomplish this goal. For me, goals to be meaningful is I I translate the next level of what does it change about my life every day. If it nothing changed about my life every day, then the goal has no value. And so if it has no value, then the work I'm doing must have value. Cuz otherwise, then I'm doing work I don't care about to get a goal that doesn't change anything about my life. That sucks. >> Yeah. That makes total sense. So, last follow up on that cuz it naturally leads to >> good, dude. This is a lot of people like you're not alone here. That's why I'm spending time on this one. Go for it. >> I appreciate you. Yeah. If I ramp up sales, I'll quickly run into a fulfillment um uh gap where we're constrained there because we're dealing with a hyper niche. I mean, there's literally like 20 people who know how to run ads with our target avatar. So, we could go out and find Google Ads people who are know how to do like just local small businesses and then train them on that stuff. >> Yeah. >> Um but it all comes at a time that's just it's very uncertain where like our cost per lead has almost doubled in the last year from like inflation and AI and things like that. So, we don't even know 5 years from now is Google, which we're heavily reliant on as a channel, if it's still going to be around. So, what's your advice on scaling that? Would you look >> at other channels? >> Don't worry about it. And I'll I'll I'll tell you why. Because that conversation has happened every single year since I've been in marketing. Because what you're saying is that marketing is changing. Marketing is literally always changing. Cuz attention changes. 10 years ago, people weren't starting YouTube channels. Things change. Right? And it's like now it's you know like the thing is is the thing that you have to bet on is that you will figure it out. >> Mhm. >> And the writing [clears throat] on the wall will be obvious. I think more entrepreneurs kill businesses out of anxiety and worry than reality does. >> Mhm. >> They're like I have this good thing, but it's not going to last forever. No business lasts forever doing exactly what it does. The things you'll do in the business will change over time, because the world changes. It makes sense. >> Yeah. >> So, said differently, if you have a certain set of customers that you understand very deeply, you understand their problems, you understand how to help them, then the services that you offer them are basically limitless. It's just whatever you need to help that person in exchange for money. Now, I'm not saying do everything for that person. I don't think that's necessarily the right business model, but like you generating leads, like they're going to still need leads. Like that demand for them for having leads will not go away. And so, then the question is just do you think you'll be able to figure it out when things change? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I do. I think we're in that transition right now, cuz you're right. We've been anxious about it for 9 years, but this is the first year we actually see like CPL significantly affected by AI. So, that's where it's like, oh, we're here now. >> Yeah. Then and great. And you worried about it for 9 years for nothing, and now it's actually here, and now you can make the shift. And you're going to do it elegantly. You're going to say, "Hey, over time, we just put 30% of your ad budget over here, 50% of your budget." And over time, you're just going to elegantly switch over. No big deal. >> Yeah. >> Like it's like we have this fear that >> SEO and AEO is the future for local small businesses. So, like lead gen or >> I think it's one of. I think there's a lot of pieces to it. But like I don't want to get into the weeds, because I don't think it matters for your decision-making process right now. >> Yeah. >> You just have to believe that you have the ability to solve this better than your customers. Do you feel like that's true? >> Yeah. >> Then yeah, dude. I wouldn't sweat it. Like I just think So, takeaways here. I think you need to raise the stakes. I need you to bet bigger. I think you need to shorten your timelines so that they're meaningful. And I think you should get the [ __ ] off your plate that's farming, and you get back to hunting and promoting. Like go close some business, and I think you'll feel better about it, because you'll actually be like making meaningful progress towards a goal that you now feel is more meaningful, because it actually has a change and impact on your life. You growing 20 or 30% is not going to change the food you eat or where you live. If you grow by 300%, it will. >> Yeah. Uh love it. >> Appreciate you, man. No, you bet, dude. Appreciate you. All right. Le chat. That is French for chat. Uh, it's also Spanish, el chat. All right. You didn't know that you're going to get a little international today, but here we are. Um, let's go here. Battle Blender. This is going to be a good one. If Alex doesn't answer your question, just know you already know what you need to do. You need to go do it. Yeah. Done. I guess that I guess that's the chat of the day. Um, all right. Lucky 7 flips, how can I convince myself to work harder? I'm lazy. I think I just did I literally think I just broke that entire thing down. Um, you need bigger stakes. That's it. You either need some big incentive that excites you or something behind you that scares you or both. But doing what you're currently doing is not working, so change it up. All right. Uh, all the repeated folks, elch, I'm just going to tell you right now I'm not going to answer your question for the rest of the day, so don't post it in there cuz I told you don't repeat it. All right. Uh, let's see what else we got. Oakley Blade, I own the most anticipated VR game in the world. That sounds a bit bold uh, cuz I haven't heard of it. Um, so 19-year-old game dev, built the game myself, can't maintain two versions, need to kill one and disappoint thousands to survive. I'm scared. Um, why don't why don't you just let the people like I don't actually understand this. Why don't you just maintain the old version uh, and then start a new one if you really want to and just let the old one basically be on break fix cuz you have people already happy with that one. Um, if that's actually true. Just a consideration. Uh, the founder of uh, Basecamp was actually talking about this very specific problem on the founders podcast. Uh, I would encourage you to listen to that pod listen to that podcast uh, episode because he literally talks about this where he had four versions of Basecamp and he said one of the big mistakes that a lot of software companies make is that they force all users to up to take the new version when they were very happy with the old version just because the founder wants something new not the customer. And so if you want to do this new thing, that's fine. Your customers might not, and they're already paying you, so just let them pay you, and then start something else. Consideration. Um XL Dave Barnett, I'm trapped in the UK. Wages are low. Do you think it's worthwhile focusing on selling internationally? Okay. Bro, strong words. You're trapped in the UK. Are you in a cage? Is someone holding you down? Like, it's 70 million people. It's like one of the largest economies in the world. There's ton There's billionaires in in the UK. I honestly don't think that I I You have two separate parts to your question. Do I think that selling internationally is a good idea? Yes. Do I think that the fact that you're selling in the UK is the thing that's limiting you? No. I think the fact that you're saying that you're trapped uh is the thing that you were believing. Like, you were you're you're selling yourself on that lie. That's not true in any way. Like, fundamentally, you just got to get a stranger to give you money to do stuff for them. That's literally how you start a business. And you're saying you're trapped in in low-wage job, I understand that. You just do it on the other hours of the day, and then as soon as you make more on the other hours of the day, here's the cool part about being in a low-wage job. You will be able to replace your income faster because you have less to replace. Real. And so, the bar of what you got to make is lower. Where you run into issues is that the way that you measure money is flawed. So, basically, one of the big issues, especially when you're poor, is that you sell from your own wallet. Like, you're like, I'm broke, and therefore I could not imagine someone spending more money than this. And I'll tell you a really interesting secret for me. Um the biggest prices that I've ever sold in my life, proportional to what my income was, was during times where I made offers that I hoped the person would say no to. So, when gym launch started, I had this launch business where I was flying out to gyms, and the business didn't work for a variety of reasons. I mean, it made money, but like I I there was there was flaws in the model. And so, we were switching to selling weight loss over the phone. And so, in the transition period, I was going to call or I called eight of the businesses or the gym owners that we're we're supposed to fly out and do the launch the next month and I told them that I wasn't going to be able to do it anymore. And so, when the first one asked me, "Hey, well, you know, you did this for a buddy of mine. It really saved his gym. Like, I know you can do it." You know, he asked me, "What would it take?" Functionally, said, "Well, how much?" And so, I made up a price that was way beyond anything I'd ever sold. Like, I'd never sold something for $6,000 before. Cuz it's crazy. I was broke, dude. Um and the guy said, "6K?" I remember him saying it like it was yesterday. He was like, "6K?" And I was like, "Yeah, $6,000." Like, I enunciated it. And he was like, "Done." And I remember like floating above my body being like, "What the [ __ ] just happened?" And then I was like, >> [clears throat] >> "Uh what card do you want to use for that?" And I wrote down his credit card and I I ran him over for $6,000 and I was like, "Holy shit." And then I had seven more calls to take. And I pitched every one of them. The next one was like, $8,000. The next one was $10,000. I just kept upping it. I was like, these guys are saying yes. The thing is just like, the thing that got me out of that was that I didn't want him to say yes. I said a price so high that I didn't want him to say yes. And then he did and it shattered my view of reality in terms of how much you can charge for things. And so, right now, the biggest risk that you have to your future is that you will sell to broke people and you will sell using broke prices. And if you watch my stuff, that's why I keep repeating it. It's cuz the hardest barriers in entrepreneurship are psychological, not practical. They're not reality. It's the ideas that you have about reality that are flawed. Your model of how the world works is not true. It is why you're not getting what you want out of reality. All right. Let's do the next uh next pregunta. That's Spanish, by the way. >> Hey Alex, I'm Aaron Smith and I run a creative studio that publishes board games. >> All right. >> My first product generated about 1.3 million last year. >> Board games? >> all Yeah. >> Is it digital or hard like cardboard board games? >> Cardboard. >> No [ __ ] Okay, what's the name of the game? >> It's called Sea Beasts. >> Sea Beasts. Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. We did a Kickstarter and then I had did e-commerce pre-sales right after that. >> Sick. >> Um so I I still haven't even delivered it. We're like in the final stages of production right now. So we'll be fulfilling it. >> Uh-huh. >> Um but in the meantime I've also developed four other games I'm going to be launching over the next 6 months. >> Okay. >> Um and my long-term goal is to build a multimedia entertainment company built around the original IP >> Okay. >> expanding into books, animation, film. >> Okay. >> Uh but right now it's just me and a handful of contractors. >> Okay. >> So deadlines are getting harder, margins getting tighter tighter. >> Yeah. >> Um yeah, yeah. I just feel the weight of it all. So I I know I need to hire, but the tricky part is I reinvested all of my profits into these next launches. So yeah. So I need to uh make sure that you know the right I get the right hire first basically. We also found out on Sunday we're pregnant with our fourth. >> Nice. >> And two, so it's like high intensity moments right now. >> Yeah. >> Uh so if you were in my shoes, what would you What were your first few hires be to scale the company to 5 million, 10 million next couple years? >> What's your heart >> Cost of the game? Heart cost the base base game would be like 12 bucks. Like the more deluxe version I have tons of like add-ons that I stack onto it. Uh it goes up to about $33 manufacturing. >> Uh I'm selling base game 80 bucks. My biggest package is 250. Uh AOV is probably 130 to 180. >> Got it. All right. You asked what I would do. I would tell all the people who gave you that 1.3 million that if they buy one of your next games, they get a second game free. So, I could double the cash that I have. Given your cost basis, a lot of that should be gross profit. Then you'll have some pat the some some padding. Number one. Yeah. It's a buy one get one offer. So, now cuz like think about it like this. Who do I think would like to buy games? People who have already bought games. And if you could tell them, "Hey, if you buy one more game, you get two more games." I think many of them will say yes. Cuz also, the money they spent was a long time ago. They don't even remember it anymore. It's gone. So, them knowing that they're going to get a bigger Christmas present sounds attractive. So, that's thing number one. Thing number two, um is I have to get clear on what your constraints are. But before I do, what's the big mistake you made so that we can name it so that you don't do it again? >> I mean, I made a ton of mistakes. >> What's the big one? What's the big one? We've already gone over. What's the big one? >> Uh just me? Like not hiring people or >> No. There's a big decision mistake you made. >> Oh boy. Uh not delivering it yet or >> Starting four more games before finishing the first one. >> Oh. Right. >> Yeah. Yeah. You're like, "Bro, I'm so stressed." It's like, "No shit." You now have to deliver on five games. You're trying to deliver five games with the sales from one. >> Yeah. >> So, what I'm doing right now is I'm trying to get Of course you are, but you're still working on them. >> Right. >> So, all of the time that you've dedicated to these other four games, if you just dedicated to the first game and closed the loop, you'd be done and you'd have cash and that would be it. And then you've complete the loop. You would have done it again. You would have learned from the feedback. Cuz the thing is is you built these other games and this is I'll tell you some truth that you don't want to hear. You're going to get feedback from the first game that you're going to be like, "Fuck, I should have do that I should incorporate that in game two, three, four." >> Mhm. >> Right. >> Yeah. >> Your game hasn't actually encountered reality yet. Like fundamentally, you just built you built a VSL. >> [laughter] >> Like that's what you have succeeded at. You drove traffic to a video that got people to buy. That is what you've succeeded at. You actually haven't built a good game yet. You've sold a game. You've made a promise well, right? We'll find out whether you delivered on it well. Okay. >> True. >> So, big picture, I want you to erase the other games from your mind for a moment. I want you to make an offer to the existing audience for the two more games that are coming down the line so you can generate some cash. I want you to not think about anything that's not now those two other games. With this extra cash, then uh we have to look at what is the thing that has taken the majority of your time. >> Mhm. [clears throat] >> And that's going to be that first hire, but what's the What is that thing that's taking most of your time that that makes you the least money? >> Most of it was customer support for like the first four months. Um yeah, it was intense. So, I got a contractor that could answer emails, but still like a part-time contractor. >> Okay. >> So, I think that's the lowest hanging fruit. Also, running ads, like I'm not actually not very good at running ads. >> Yeah. >> I've ran the same same uh creative for a year and it still performs. >> Yeah. >> Thank god. >> Yeah, thank god. >> So, yeah, enough. Uh so, that that's another thing that takes up the time of my time and I'm also not the best at it, too. Like I know that. >> Yeah. >> Um and then uh just other operational like trying to get the business like actually up and running um as far as just all the back end operations, fulfillment, logistics. >> Dude, I think you're spending a lot of time being distracted because right now you have no employees and you >> Yep. >> like you have added complexity to your life and I think you spend a lot of time not sure what to do and that is what's eating your time. >> That's 100% yeah. >> Right. >> a juggling act. >> Yeah, which means you need clarity. Right? Anxiety comes from a lot of different actions and no priorities. >> Mhm. >> That's where anxiety comes [clears throat] from and so you're feeling right now. >> And to eliminate anxiety, you do that through subtraction. You need to take things away. >> Yep. >> All right, so there there's two versions of this reality. I would prefer you get some cash up front, but that does increase the load because you're going to have these two other things that you're going to have to now deliver on, right? So that's the that's the trade there. The alternative version of this, like if Leila were sitting next to me, what she would probably say is forget the other four games exist. I'll tell like I I can play both hats because Leila and I know each other's advice good enough at this point. I'm I'm a yes hand person, she's a no hand person, which is why we work well. She would probably say, "Hey, don't do anything with those four because they're probably going to suck because you're going to get feedback from the first one. Uh how much cash do you have of that 1.3?" >> Uh the 1.3, uh about 150. >> Jeez, bro. How much did you spend on these other four games? >> The other four, I'm probably about over probably about 150 as well, actually. Yeah. >> Well, then what did you I mean, can you deliver the games that you promised with the cash you have? >> Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. >> Well, then bro, deliver the games. >> for all of it. Yeah. >> Well, just like your entire objective of life right now is just deliver the games. >> Yep. >> All right. And so you said there's like operations. Like dude, you have no employees. What is the operations? >> Right. >> It's like and literally the delivery for your thing is shipping, which you're not probably handling. >> Yeah, I I have some fulfillment partners that I'm managing, but they're also the freight, too, that I'm doing. >> Well, yeah, but that's But, here's what I'm saying here. Like, you you've added You added endless complexity to a business where people made a purchase, you send them a cardboard box with toys in it. >> Yep. >> Right. And so, you got some people in between that are asking for refunds. Great. Hire a virtual assistant, they can respond to the emails. Now what? >> Yeah. Oh, virtual assistant, yeah, that's >> What else we got? >> I mean, uh long term, though >> I'm not worried about long term, dude. You're worried about long term, and long term is killing your short term, which is going to prevent your long term. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> You need You made a promise. You got to deliver on the promise. Once you do that, you can have a full accounting of how much cash you got left. Then, you can spend that extra cash on these other things that you've developed, which you will probably tweak based on the feedback you get from your customers. >> Right. Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, we are going to be delivering in the next month or so. So, like, manufacturing is wrapping up, and it's going to be on boats. So, it's it's practically there. Um so, I'm basically looking at the next step off. >> Yeah. >> And I'm mid-Kickstarter right now for that second game, yeah, and and it's performing exactly the same as the first one. Um so, that's that's also >> I think you should join a community >> Very good. >> that like Join something specific to Facebook ads if you want. Um so that you can learn how to run ads. Like, to me, that is by far the biggest lever that you are missing right now. Obviously, you can look at Qualium in terms of how we do our like mass production of ads and content. Um like, there's tons of stuff inside of Answer Stage about that. Um >> Yeah. >> And like, that is what like, when you're like, I don't like You said You said ads are taking a lot of your time, but you also said you only have one one one ad that's converting. So, like, it sounds like you're just staring at it saying like, if there's something that should happen here, and I don't know what to do. You need to go learn and experiment. You have to try [ __ ] >> Right. Yeah. I've been doing some experimental stuff, but um not at mass scale that >> gives me answers. >> Here's something tactical. Give yourself a learning budget on ads. Pick a number that you don't care about too much. So, a thousand, two thousand, five thousand, ten thousand dollars a month. And take that number and be willing to lose 100% of it learning how to run ads. >> Cool. >> And that means that you're going to experiment. So, all of that of that X dollars per month, take 70% put it towards things that are almost identical to the winner. 20% is adjacent and then 10 is just wild [ __ ] ideas. >> Okay. >> All right. That's your tactical thing. Do not worry about the other four games. Make sure you complete your promises in the first thing. And you as an entrepreneur, you need to focus on one thing at a time, dude. Like you will like Hewlett or Packard had this quote um which is businesses die from indigestion not starvation. We take on too much not too little. That is how businesses die because you get spread too thin and you can't focus on anything. That's where the anxiety comes from. You have to eliminate. >> Yeah. I like it. That's good. >> All right. Appreciate you, brother. >> Appreciate it. >> Yep. >> All right. >> Rock and roll. >> We'll see it. >> All right. Uh okay. Melissa Gumroki. Uh I burned out chasing success and over time avoiding hard work became a habit. I'm rebuilding and willing to make the sacrifices. How do I break the plateau? Uh without Right. Sorry. How do I break the pattern without returning to unhealthy habits? Man, you've got a lot of words in there uh that feel very heavy. Um I think this is really important. So, I'm going to say this again for everyone cuz I'm I'm going to repeat Melissa's question. I burned out chasing success. We have no idea what success means here. And over [clears throat] time avoiding hard work became a habit. So, you just didn't do [ __ ] Okay. I'm rebuilding now. But it's like you're not rebuilding. Like we're not building a house, right? Again, I I I'm so so anal with language because we we weave ourselves into these traps uh and we create handcuffs with the words that we use that don't mean anything. Right? And so we create these visual words like handcuffs that chain us to our present, but there is no chain. You are not a prisoner. You can just do whatever the [ __ ] you want. And so you're rebuilding now willing to make sacrifices. Like what sacrifices are we talking about? How do I break the pattern? So in this condition I behave a specific way without returning to my unhealthy habits, my other patterns, which let's define healthy, right? And so All right, zooming out, Melissa. You just have to do stuff that gets you the outcome you want. And if you're not doing that stuff, then it means that you are more rewarded for doing nothing than doing the thing, which makes sense. And so you will need to have something that motivates you in a good way that you can go towards or something that motivates you in a bad way that you can run away from. You can use both, you can use one, it doesn't really matter. But I think that like when you said you got burned out chasing success, like I hit this one earlier, like you need I think some people need to I need to make bigger risks. You need to make bigger bets. Like it's like I'm only willing to do this thing, but if it does work, it doesn't matter. It's like, well, then why do it? Like make a bigger bet. Make a bet that you're like a little nervous about because that's what's going to motivate you. Right? It's the stakes. I think stakes are not spoken enough about. Like you have you have you've reached a certain level of competence. You're able to like feed yourself and and and and and go to work every day. Congratulations. That's good. That's an accomplishment. Nothing wrong with that. Um but I think that like you have to look back like a lot of a lot of my life I spend looking backwards from a future version of myself saying, "What will I be dissatisfied about the person that I am today?" Like what will that guy say about today? What will he nitpick me for? That that I would be ashamed of in the future. And then I let that shame of my future self motivate me today to move. But at the end of the day, I think you just got to do some [ __ ] and not worry about all these words they're using because I think they are just keeping you down. All right. Our Our friend Katara Katari. All right. Uh Alex, I want to start my own agency, but due to AI, I'm afraid to start it. Man, everyone's so afraid. Uh I've been planning on it for 2 years. Bruh. Bruh. But couldn't start it. Why? I'm 16. Okay, to be fair, that's you are young. Uh >> [laughter] >> I was 12. Should I start the agency or should I switch? All right, dude. You're not switching cuz you haven't started, right? Um That was all time, by the way. That was a great. Um Dude, start. Start. 100%. Be like, if you're 16 and you're watching my stuff, you're way ahead of the game, man. Um And again, there's this fear, right? I I you keep seeing that I keep seeing this this return, this fear around the future. And it's like, I'm going to let something unknown in the future prevent me from taking something that is known today. We have like so little faith in our ability to figure things out. Like, if I could wish one thing for you, it's that you will figure it out. So, let me give you an idea. Think back. So, this is this is actually really good. A lot of people talk about confidence, right? They're like, I want to have more confidence. Okay. Confidence is domain specific, but over time can generalize. So, what does that mean? So, if I am good at singing, I sing, and then eventually uh I don't have any stress about singing. Now, I might have stress about public speaking. But if I sing enough times and I talk between my acts, I might get to a point where I say, "Huh, I don't I don't I don't think I should be nervous for speaking. I've I've kind of done something really close to that before. So, this should kind of carry." And then let's say you speak and then you don't get nervous and you get to do a good job. So, then you start to think to yourself, "Huh, whenever I do new things, I prepare like I did for singing and speaking and I tend to succeed in general when I dedicate time and effort towards an endeavor that I find meaningful. And so, I haven't done this thing yet, but I am confident that I will be able to succeed because I've done so in the past." And so, I'll give you a little example of this. I was very nervous to do public speaking. Now, you might hear this and be like, "Alex, how could you be nervous for public speak? You are All you do is public speak, right?" Which to be fair, this is like camera and I got like two dudes around me. All right, so it's not Let's not get over, you know, get get hot and bothered about it. But, um when I uh it was in high school, I like choked doing my like presentation where you like get up and there's like 12 people in class and you're like, "Abraham Lincoln." You know, like whatever, right? And so, I assumed that I just was very nervous to do public speaking. And the first public speaking I did as an adult, so post business, was to a 1,200 person room. So, I went from high school with 30 people or whatever people are in the room to 1,200. 40x. Big delta. And what was interesting is I remember right as I was about to go on stage, I was like, "I'm not that nervous." And I was like, "Why am I not that nervous?" And so, I thought to myself, I was like, "Well, I've spoken in front of people with a mic a lot of times." And so, my aha moment was two things. Number one, I was like, "I was nervous before cuz I was talking about something I didn't understand. I'm just telling [ __ ] I did. So, there's nothing to be nervous about cuz they don't know what I did. I know what I did. So, there's no there's no discrepancy." Now, before this, there was a guy uh who was a teacher who was going to grade me on whether he He Abraham Lincoln better than me. And the answer was he did. Right? Cuz I did it the night before. And he's He was a history teacher. That's literally what he dedicated his life to. Right? And so, of course he'd be better at it. And it would make sense for me to be nervous cuz I will be less than whatever he thinks the potential is. He's seen 100 students, and I'm probably not going to be this one. So, number one, I knew the subject. Second, was that I realized that I had skills that generalized. This is really important. This is like Honestly, if you guys can take away this thing towards all futures endeavors, it would be worth it for just listening to this this live of this podcast or whatever. I realized that I had when I was a trainer, had a mic and a group of people, and I was telling them what to do. And I would do it for 8 hours a day. And I never thought much about it because I was like, well, that's I mean, this was my job, right? And so, all I was like, all I'm going to do is get on stage again with a mic and tell people what to do. It's the same thing. And so, all of a sudden, my anxiety around this just like dissipated. I was like, well, I know what I'm talking about, and I'm going to do a mic, and I've done this 100 times before. And so, the idea is that you might not have done that thing before, but you can generalize something that you have done before towards that thing, which allows you to extrapolate or stand atop your past history. And so, one of my most quoted tweets of all time was um outwork your self-doubt. But you want to give yourself a stack of undeniable proof that you are who you say you are. Right? And so, the idea again is not the affirmations in the mirror, it's the stack of undeniable proof. But the stack of undeniable proof doesn't mean like the perfect world is that you've done 1,000 sales calls before. But if I had never done a sales call before, what would I think? So, I'm going to give you a frame. This is a a mindset. Uh I don't even like using that term, but whatever. It's a lens to see through reality through. Have I spoken on the phone 1,000 times? Yes. Have I spoken to strangers before on the phone? Yes. In what conditions? I've made reservations. I've called I've called for a doctor's offices. I've called for restaurants. I've called for mechanic shops to ask if XYZ. I have spoken to strangers before. I've spoken a thousand times on the phone. So, I've done things that approximate this really close. So, why do I have this tremendous fear? I shouldn't because it is not as unknown as I think it is. For sure, there are some unknowns, but it's not 100% unknown. It might be 20% unknown. And so, I would encourage you, whenever you're about to start something new, don't think, "Oh my god, I've never done anything like this before." Of course, you haven't done something exactly like that before, but you have done things like it before. And so, all you have to do is get more and more abstract in terms of the things that you generalize. So, the example I started with was the singer, right? She sang, and then she talked in between, and then she could extrapolate that to public speaking. Okay. But, if she then said, "I want to code on a computer," that would be different in terms of core skills. But, do we believe that she has learned to approach any new thing with the same process of doing repetitions beforehand, so that she prepares ahead of time, and then when she needs to execute, she does because she has done it she has stacked the reps. And the answer is yes. And so, when she does her coding boot camp, she can succeed because and this is in my opinion I I don't love the phrase how you do one thing is how you do everything, but I do like the idea of how you approach one thing that you deem meaningful is how you will approach other things that you deem meaningful. All right, with that, let's do the next caller. Let's do it. Let's dance. >> Hey Alex. >> Bailemos un poco. That's Spanish for let's dance. A little. Go for it. >> Hey, my name is Jason. I'm the technical founder of Starter School. We do online courses for tech education for teenagers. >> Cool. >> And we run uh a bunch of webinars. Basically, we're 100% paid ads on Facebook. Uh we have a direct to cart model currently priced at 297 for a batch of like seven courses. We do a couple order bumps and then we have a post purchase upsell for 189 which is like everything we have basically think. We did about 700,000 top line in May. >> Good for you, man. >> Profit on that was about 2 or 300,000 somewhere in there. But the only reason that was possible was because the row as that we were getting was like between a two and a three. But since then the row as has dropped a lot closer to a one and we wind down to about 150k top line is what we're going to close this month as. >> Okay. >> So we're on track [clears throat] to lose about 60 grand. We've got 180 grand in the bank. >> All right. >> And one of the things that we've learned from watching Jason Fladlien and your videos and all kinds of research is that we need a high ticket offer. But the only thing we can come up with high ticket is like this idea of hey well, you know, we'll do like a white glove like coaching service and maybe actually really get some hands on with these kids. >> Mhm. >> Cuz we know that time spent with us is pretty valuable. >> Mhm. >> And so my question to you is is that a different arrow cuz I know you tell so many people hey don't go off and do this totally different thing, right? Stick to your main business. Is that a different arrow or how would you think about this? Should we be offering something that can be automated as a higher ticket to fix our problem or should we be really considering this other manual arrow? >> Okay. So first off congrats. Second off sorry about the current situation. Couple different ways to approach this. So one is like if you went from 3x row as last month to 1x row as I would bet that it's a creative issue, right? We just need to pump more good creative back out and you'll be back up. It's not like the in 30 days the algorithm changed, right? The other thing and this is again technical is that like we might have to look at the pixel event because you know, meta might be optimizing around something that's lower in the funnel or not getting the ideal customer. And so I found a new pocket of people that are less likely to purchase. Um and so, the pixel's getting trained on the wrong the wrong audience. So, like that those would be my like first two gut checks that I would do before changing the business model, right? Now, if I were to change the business model, it really reverse engineers from what the goal you have for the business is. Like there's nothing wrong with having a business that is has almost entirely automated uh delivery. Um you can add a lot of leverage to delivery by just keeping it in group and still selling high ticket. Where you will then uh encounter uh kind of like an operational bottleneck will be your sales team, but it's still going to be pretty high leverage. So, how many tickets are you sell I when I say tickets, like how many um how many how many widgets are you selling uh per week? >> Uh it's probably at least between 10 and 50 a day, depending on how well our ads are ripping. >> Okay, got it. So, that's fine. So, if I had like basically if you had call it three-ish sales guys that all they did was on the thank you page after they uh buy buy the the product, uh they get a complimentary call it onboarding call, right? You would be able to set them up for a call it $5 to $10,000 purchase um on the back end, and that would materially change your metrics. The question is who's making the purchases? Is it teenagers? Is it Is it parents? >> Yeah, that's I'm so glad you asked because I I was dying to ask you this question, too. So, like parents, we're advertising mostly to moms. That's our highest profit cohort. >> Perfect. Yeah. >> Uh between [snorts] like 32 and 55. >> Yeah. >> But when we sell to the moms, the moms then go talk to their kids, and they're like, "Hey, I got this really cool thing. I think you're going to like it." And then the kids are like, "No, AI uses too much water. No, AI is this. AI is that." >> really? Is that what the kids are saying these days? >> Yeah. Yes, so >> Is it really? Bro, I'm on status right now. >> Yes, sir. >> They're saying the water, too much water? >> You are going to be stuck into the world of AI whether you like it or not. Every service you use is going to be using it. You're going to participate unless you want to become Amish. So, like how do we get that across to the kids, you know? >> Okay. Got it. Um I would say this is that the much simpler fix to the bit Okay, so if I wanted to have the simplest fix without creating a whole another monster of a back end, right? In terms of delivery and sales team and whatnot, which to be fair, I I'm very good at that, which is what I built a lot of businesses around. So, like I can talk to it at length, but if you've never done it before, it probably wouldn't be my first solution set. So, my first solution set would be the the following three things. So, number one is I would make sure the creative is speaking to the most high-quality avatar, number one. Number two, look at um I don't know if you have this level of attribution, but um you should be able to see uh which ads specifically are generating the highest LTV cohort. So, the people who are taking the upsell at the 189. I would want my pixel event not just to be on the purchase, but ideally on the purchase post upsell cuz then we can train the pixel on the best quality audience. And I um think that your upsell is likely mispriced, that 189. Um I think you could probably get away with something that's like $1,500. Because even if a small percent Yeah, even if a small percentage of people take it, it's going to make a much bigger difference, right? Cuz like what what's your take rate on the 189 right now? >> It's pretty good, like 30, 40%. >> Yeah. Let's say it's Let's say it's a third. So, it's like you get 70 on top of your what? Two 297? So, it's 370-ish average cart? >> Yeah, the average order value is around four three to $400. >> Yeah. Like if you had like a $1,500 upsell, even if you had a 5% conversion on it, right? Well, 5% would be equivalent, but if you had a 10% conversion on it, you get 150. It would be something I would look at. Um and I would just do it as a group cohort. Like if I like you could probably just test all my other courses for 1,500 and see what happens. Um as option one. Option two is you do all my other courses plus you know, a 12-week accelerated boot camp on the back that's just purely one to many. You know, one call a week in a community. That's very light on the delivery side. Um and that wouldn't require you to build a sales team. Uh and so I said in sequence, number one more and better creative, ideally target around the customers that have the highest LTV. Number two, put the pixel behind the optic rate so that it still takes 14 days for the pixel to reset, but that's like I would I would look at that. Um the third test I would run or the third thing I would do is that I would run uh a high ticket uh OTO as my as my immediate thing cuz that way we don't have to build anything else. And if one, two, and three do not solve the problem, then I would consider increasing lifetime gross profit by adding kind of the heavy stuff, which is let's add a sales team, let's call all the customers, let's sell them a five or ten thousand dollar thing on the back. >> Thank you so much, man. Appreciate your insight. >> No, appreciate you, dude. Congratulations on the business. Uh I think you had a bad month, man, and I think that if you just like fix the [ __ ] and actually make like instead of going like I'm going to make a pure AI ads, here's a little ask for you. Here's bonus number five. Make five ads from scratch manually yourself that you think are [ __ ] bangers. And then do all the other [ __ ] as AI. But I think there's just been this big loss of like the art of marketing that's happened because everyone's AI-ing [ __ ] and it's just the the quality's still not there. >> Yeah, cuz I'm like I'm the technical founder, so I have another uh founder. He's doing uh all the videos and actual content that actually turns into the ads. Yeah. But you know, on my end I'm like, all right, I I to nail attribution. So I built my own pixel. I'm like predicting refunds and upsells and LTV and reporting that back to Facebook. Like, I'm doing all of the things, man. I'm pulling out everything I got to make attribution good. >> Yeah. >> So. >> So, I would I would encourage you to not just throw a bunch of [ __ ] on the wall and see what sticks, but make a handful that you actually like, I really think these will work. And run those, too. Because I'll bet you if you go for broke on the ads on the creative, it'll make a significant difference for your next webinar. >> All right. Thank you so much. >> Appreciate you, brother. All right. Ash Guy Ari Da. Nah, man. It's just a sad reality of how media is brainwashing people with exaggerated facts. Truth. M Bailey, data centers and AI data center absolutely love this water. I'm an AI. All right, whatever. I'm done with AI water. Okay. him.ed, hi Alex. Should I focus on building a tight audience in social to attract high ticket clients or build a wider personal brand to get traffic from leads to get blah blah blah. Everyone has to hear H2H. Talk about the [ __ ] you do and you will get people who are interested about the [ __ ] that you do and then they will pay you to do the [ __ ] that you do for them. And so, fundamentally, you just want to associate with the stuff that you find interesting. So, I think that if you think like, your personal brand should be reflective of your life. So, if you work 8 hours a day and you've got 4 hours of extra [ __ ] and let's say that the 4 hours of extra [ __ ] is maybe split between two or three things, then proportionally, your content should represent you. And so, I work a lot. And so, the majority of my content is about business cuz that's the majority of my life. I do have some stuff with Leila cuz Leila's in my life as well. I don't spend as much time with Leila as I do working. I work out every day. And I guess me being jacked is in content. So, I guess that's permanent. There's nothing I can do about that. It's irreversible. All right. So, if you That's what a warning, by by way. If you do get too muscular, people will find out and it's it's it's terrible. Uh Um but the TLDR is if you want people to buy your thing, then make stuff about the stuff that you want them to buy. And if part of that is you, that's fine. I would just make sure that represent in terms of how you're representing your content by by quantity, it should be about the stuff uh that you want to sell. All right. Uh White 5933 I'm out. I'm Alex. Alex, I'm 20. I dropped out of college years ago due to finances. My goal is to make as much money as possible. Should I go back to college or go on a business? Go on a business, dude. Like what what is it what is college going to do? Like that ship has sailed. And I'm guessing that it was not like some premier Harvard that you dropped out of cuz they either have financial aid or you're rich for going there, so probably not your issue. Uh so yeah, I would just learn. There's so many skills you can learn. Just pick one and then do it for somebody else in exchange for money. Cuz people are lazy, you just have to be less lazy than the laziest person. Think about this. All you have to do is be less lazy than your customer. So yeah, that's it. You got to be less lazy than your customer. Or serve someone so rich that they want people to they'll pay anyone everyone to do everything. In which case, great. That works, too. Uh all right. George Paladichuk Dude, these names are wild. All right, is selling to enterprise clients the same as selling to SMB just different messaging? Uh not really. So I'll get This is really good. So the difference between selling to enterprise and selling to SMB is actually the sales conversation itself is not that dissimilar. It's just that you have to do it 10 times in a row. So it's kind of like you sell person A to get you to person B and then you sell person B using the same pitch to get you to person C. You sell person C to get you to person D and then finally person D is the decision maker, right? And then you get the sale. And so that is the big difference. I think there's a lot of smoke and mirrors around enterprise sales being like it's a longer sales cycle. What it really just means is you have to sell more people on the same thing. That's what it is. And so I would not overly distract yourself about like oh enterprise sales is X Y or Z. You just have to do a certain amount of outbound to get someone on the hook to respond and then once you get your foot in the door, you get an internal champion which just means that person refers you to somebody else who has more authority than or has control over the budget so that they can say yes and then give you money. But you're basically doing the same conversation 10 times. Not like there's this magic arc that you have to cover all this stuff. All the key holders and decision They have all these terms, right? But it's just you're going to you're going to pitch a lot of people to get 20 people to say yes to make one big sale. That's the difference. Okay, I think that's pretty good simplification for a lot of people. >> [cough and laughter] >> All right. Um Savante, which one do you want to do? Which one are you feeling? >> Biz. >> Biz? Biz, all right, Biz. I'm 25 and I did 25 million plus selling B2C biz op, all right? I've lost motivation cuz I don't think this vehicle can grow three to 10X. Yes. Uh how do I know when to pivot and which vehicle to express uh to fully express my potential and skill? Good question, dude. So you obviously understand how to do direct response. You understand probably how to do webinars. Probably understand how to do high ticket sales teams. So you attached uh a really valuable skill set to a a low leverage opportunity. Now to be clear, you can make money with doing it, you know? Um no question there. Uh you know, it's very rare for biz op to get over $100 million a year and typically they don't last uh because they're arbitrage opportunities by their very nature either by media in terms of like how they're acquiring customers or by the very nature of the business opportunity that they're selling. So there's just there's leverage that expands and explodes for short periods and they kind of they pop and disappear. So it's more of like a it's like a pop-up business that like disappears and then you have to pop up another one. That's why people go from launch to sorry, from offer to offer to offer. Uh and like no one outside of the biz op world talks that way because they talk in products and businesses, but biz op is about offers. Um so that being said, uh you're losing motivation because you feel like you can't really build things and I understand why because you have a churn factory where you're just selling customers and many of them aren't successful because the nature of who is attracted to a business opportunity in general. And so, I think that what would make sense is like you take your very, you know, good acquisition skills and tie it to an actual business opportunity for you to go pursue the the opportunity. Right? Like the fastest money you can make is selling ladders. The biggest money you can make is climbing them. Right? Like the fastest money you make is selling shovels. The biggest money you make is actually finding the gold mine. It just takes longer and is more work. I think that's pretty deep. That's profound. All right. Let's do the next one. Sir Kevin, let's rock. >> Yeah, can you hear me? >> Uh, barely. What's Say it again. Say it louder. >> Can you hear me? >> Barely. >> Uh, one second. >> There we go. Now you're good now. Go for it. >> Okay. >> All right. >> So, my name is Matthew. I'm 19 years old. I started working online since I was 15. Today I started with a bunch of businesses and failed. >> Right. >> And then I stumbled into my my previous successful business where I built a software to manage people's accounts. So, I'd have clients logging in with 20 to 50 accounts and then my software would post uh, these clients all over the these accounts. So, I'd save them time and effort. I ran this business for about 2 years and then the media companies basically patched what I was using. So, my business went from doing $100,000 a month in profit to zero. That being said, I built a massive network of influencers. So, I was able to bounce back and leverage those contacts and now we're on a management company where I get cheap labor from Asian countries to where they get paid a good salary from their countries and it's still enough for me to make a profit. So, now my income is about $20,000 a month in profit. It's still good money, but I basically cut me to a 70% loss. I was able to save up around 700,000 leading up to now. >> Okay. >> What do you think I should do? Do I continue running this business over or do I try and find another software that I can build to scale like my previous my previous business? The only reason I'm having issues scaling right now is because my management company is labor intensive. So, I rely on the the >> Yeah, work. >> I hire from outside. >> You have a service business. You have a service business. >> So, it's hard to find competent people to work for me. >> Well, I mean, welcome to [clears throat] business. >> Yeah, another thing is with me being 19 years old with this much of money I've basically lost most of the relationships I had because everything now revolves around my money is what I think is happening. >> All right. >> What would you do to change in my scenario considering my age? And where would you put the money that I have amassed to where I'm financially free by the age of 25? >> You're not financially free, man. You're in a good spot, but you're not like, "Okay, I can retire now." Um so, I would just stop saying that cuz it's not true. Um it might make you feel better, but it's not true. Um that being said, first off, kudos. Second off, um I think that you're in a service business. You've done a software business. Um and I would stop thinking from the perspective of what can I do with the $700,000 because the businesses that you've started you haven't needed the money for. And so, it's not like you're going to go like, "Okay, I'm going to start a coal mining plant." Right? Like the $700,000 in some ways it limits you. Um I'll give you an analogy and then I'll answer your question, which is a lot of times people think about business strategy like they think about what they're going to eat. So, they like open up the door of the refrigerator, they look inside, and say, "Okay, I've got apples, I've got bananas, I've got some rice." And they try and think, "Okay, what do I want to eat from these things?" But the best way to figure out what you want to eat is just ask yourself what like what do I want to eat? And then you can go buy the food and figure it out. And so, I think it sounds like you will always chase this idea or it sounds like you preferred the software business to the one you have. I'm guessing. And >> Because if it was easier, I could control the outcome. >> understand. Yeah. And so, I think that it makes sense for you to like again, all risk is personal, but you're 19 years old. You don't have a lot of downside. Even if you lost everything today, you'd just be a poor 19-year-old, which is just the same as most 19-year-olds. So, like not actually a big deal cuz you'd have big experience and skills, which you already have. And so, I'm an advocate of you betting big on you and not settling for this particular business because I think you have the skills to do something bigger and better. And so, if you are kind of worried, like don't worry about your current station in life going down if the income from your service business goes to zero because you have the cash. Like I'd rather you live on the cash you have so that like that $700,000 I'd rather you just live on that so you can go aggressive on the bets that you're going to make in the business that you really want to run than have your ego tied up in the fact that you're making 20-30k a month in a service business that you don't want to keep forever. >> Mhm. Yes, I'm trying to keep my costs down to 2 to 3,000 dollars a month so I don't have to worry about expenses in the future. >> Good. >> But the 20 to 30,000 is kind of upsetting me because I was doing 100 to 120,000 dollars a month in profit before. So, I'm not sure if I should shut down this current business and take a year off or something. >> Well, you don't need to take a year off, dude. I don't think it's going to take I don't think it's going to take you a year to figure it out. I think if you don't have distractions, you'll figure it out pretty quickly. >> Do you think I should pivot from social media to another software business, or do you think I should still stick to social media because that is my main specialty right now? >> Well, yeah. I mean, also, you're you're young, which means that you could start from zero today and it doesn't really matter. So, I would look at the opportunity size and then just I mean, it seems like you're sharp. You're not going to have done what you did by your age without being intelligent and hard working. Um and so, I think you thinking what what do you want to have happened? >> Um, I want to scale to 2 to 300,000 a month. >> Yeah, dude. Uh, let me just let me just pop a balloon for you. It's going to happen really fast as soon as you get your next thing. And it like let me just let me just give you a page out of my own book. One of the biggest mistakes I've made as an entrepreneur has been that I think only one step ahead sometimes. So, I only add one zero to my income, and then I think how do I go do that? And then I go put a lot of effort into doing one more zero on my income. And then once I get there, I'm like, "Shit. If I had thought two zeros ahead, I wouldn't have done this at all. I would have done something totally different." So, I would prefer that you think how do I get to 2 million a month or 10 million a month, and then think what businesses can I do that would get me there, and then look at the market size, look at how many customers it would take, look what churn would look like, look at what acquisition would look like, and think can I actually do that? Like, does do the laws of physics prevent me from prevent me from doing that? If there's nothing prevents you from doing that, then that's the business that I would start. And so, the answer to your original question is, uh, do I think that you should quit your existing service business to go pursue a more scalable opportunity? Given the fact that you already have $700,000 saved up, you live on $2,000 a month, and that's what you ultimately want to do long term, yes, I think it makes sense to make the bet. Obviously, that decision's yours, but I think that from a risk perspective, it makes sense. >> So, you're saying go extreme? >> Yeah. You can go extreme, dude. You don't have a wife, you don't have kids that are relying on you. Like, you can bet big on yourself. Like, the the big advantage of having a nest egg is that you can make bets. And like, the bet is if you spend $3,000 a month living, great. You just can spend time fully focused. There's There's There's such a huge opportunity cost to your skill set getting wasted on a service business that's making 20, 30k a month. Again, there's nothing wrong with that. I think many people would would love that that that goal, but you've already proven that you can do more than that. And so, go do more than that. Just do not put yourself worth in your cash flow. Which Which be hard. >> kind of I can kind of resonate to the point where you said you could get to that point really quickly because I I kind of saw a very >> Of course. Right. >> spike from 20,000 to 100,000 and I got to that point and I was like, "Okay, what's next?" >> Right. So, look for 10 million a month. Look for a business that can do that. And then build one that way. All right? >> I have one more question. Uh uh >> Make it fast. >> Me me having traditional parents that want me to go into uni, >> Yeah. >> what do you think I should do when that conversation pops up? >> At some point you're going to decide that you're going to be your own man. It's you either before college or after college, but at some point you're going to have to make your own decisions. >> I appreciate that. I appreciate it. >> You bet, brother. And uh I don't know, maybe maybe we'll clip this moment or this live will be live for them. So, give me 2 seconds. What's your What are your parents' names? >> Um my parents' names are Ahmed and Mary. >> I'm going to mess that up. All right. So, if you are Mehdi's parents, hopefully I didn't say that incorrectly. Um you probably don't know who I am. My name's Alex Hormozi. Um I have this portfolio that does $250 million a year. I also had immigrant parents. Um I understand the position that you're in, which is that you want to make sure that Mehdi is is successful, and you think, like my parents did, that Mehdi studying is a degree is a great downside protection. It's like, "Okay, if he has a degree, he'll still be able to get a job." I can promise you he's unemployable. He will no longer be able to get a job. He's had a taste of the freedom that comes from business and the stakes. He will be more miserable if he graduates with a degree and then gets a normal job than he is if he just if if you just let him live on his own and actually pursue his own things. He will also fail multiple times between now and the end. And what I would encourage you to do is not say, "I told you so," but be willing to just support the fact that he's going all in. And I think you have something that's incredibly rare, which is you have a you have a incredibly talented and motivated son. And I think that getting in the way of that would be a great disservice. And I'll be very clear. I I I appreciate your attention, which is that you want to serve and and support him in the best way that you know possible. It's just that the world has changed. And I think that the advice and the counsel that you give as a parent has to change with it. And I think you will best equip him um by basically giving him the freedom without judgment to pursue his passions because he knows how to make money. He will not suffer the he will not not be able to feed himself, which is the big fear. There's plenty of ways to make money. He already has enough skills in order to do that. But the thing that he is more at risk of doing is settling for a goal that is too small in order to appease you and then in so doing be miserable. And I only know this cuz I did it. Cool. You can play this for them, all right? >> Sounds good, Alex. Thank you. >> Appreciate you, brother. All right. Woo! What do we got here? Um Reaper kills 4988. [laughter] Hey, Alex, your back's against the wall and you had no money, how would you make as much money with digital marketing in 48 Dude, this is a terrible question. Um with digital marketing agency in 48 hours, you know, what what should I what outbound should I focus on? Reaper kills, you are killing me. Um All right. I'm going to give everybody the the the the secret, all right? If you have a business and you need to make a lot of money in a short period of time, which sometimes happens because you've got payroll due, you've got an unexpected tax bill, a big piece of machinery breaks and you have to pull cash forward to buy a new piece, things happen. And so there are three places in a business that you can find money fast and they are in order. Number one, you go to your existing customers and you ask them to prepay for future services or future products. So if you have people who buy services from you, say, "Hey, can I get you to prepay for a year?" Can you give them additional services at no cost in order to get them to prepay? If they aren't willing to do that, ask them if they'll just buy future services the same level at a discount, which I don't I'm not a fan of, but I'd rather give away services to pull cash forward than give discounts. But either of those, if you need the cash, you need the cash. So number one is you go to existing customers, get them to prepay. Number two, is you go to past customers cuz the next most likely people to give you money are people who have already given you money. All right? And so these are non-active customers but people who have paid you in the past. And what you do is you give them an IOU money campaign, which is an email or text that says, "Hey, I owe you money." And what you do is you take the money that they've already spent with you and you say, "I'm willing to credit that towards future purchases." So, if someone spent $200 with you, you get them on the phone, if you're, you know, if you're if you do phone sales, uh or you could do it via email and say, "Hey, I will credit you this $200 towards $2,000 worth of services in the future." As in like, "I'm going to give you a bigger package of the stuff that I'm selling right now um and I'm giving you this great deal because I owed you the money uh as my way of like, "Hey, I made these promises before and I didn't deliver them as well as I think I can now. And so, I want to give you all of what you've spent with me already towards working with me again because I'm so confident of the things that I'm doing now would actually help you." That's the second source. So, existing customers and then past customers. The third is you go to your leads list, right? So, you have a Each of these is small, medium, large, right? The smallest group is going to be people actively paying you. The next biggest chunk is people who have already paid you. And then the biggest chunk of all is people who haven't paid you yet. But that is the order that you would approach and then if you're going for that that group at the bottom, you're going to want to do one of the attraction offers that I have in the Money Models book, which if you don't have any money, you can go to my site. It's free. You can watch the video and the audio book is free on my podcast. And it goes through buy one, get one, win your money back. You want to have a very sexy compelling offer that pulls cash forward. And those are the three places that you can look right now if you have to get make cash in 48 hours. All right. It's your pick. What do you think? Which question? >> Streetwear question. >> You like streetwear? All right. Uh Geo Arts? I don't know. Uh how would you sell a streetwear brand in a developing country where most people prioritize necessities like food? How do you create enough value and desire for them to spend on non-essential apparel? Really good question, man. Um I think the question you ask is how do you sell umbrellas in the desert? So, you don't want to like the number one requirement for demand is a starving crowd. You have to have people who want it. You don't want to create demand, you want to channel demand. Now, there's two scenarios that I could see this this model working. Model number one is that you sell to the rich. And so what I mean there is that you might have a, you know, developing country that has many poor people, but there are wealthy people. And the wealthy people want everyone to know that they're wealthy. And so you want to Those are the audience. It's a much smaller slice, but there's the people willing to pay a premium to demonstrate that they have status in that community. All right? So, your streetwear brand is fine. It will probably have to be premium and it targeted towards the people who have the money, rather than trying to convince people who don't have money to spend money they don't have. Okay? Thing one. Thing two. You can also consider, because of the internet, we're here right now. I'm in America, I'm not in a developing country, but you are and so we're still talking. Um, is that you sell not where you live. And so there's tons of different resources out there in order for you to drop ship, design, ship, cut, 3PL, all of that out of the US to the US, if you need it to. And so you could very well basically do all your business in the US, sell to people who have discretionary income and live your life in a country that uh is developing and live like a king. Because you don't need to make very much money in US dollars to live in most other countries very comfortably, especially developing. And so I'd see either of those scenarios working. Door number three, because you didn't ask for it, is you could always just sell stuff in that country that those people want. But I'm not a big fan of trying to for I do not want to educate an entire audience about why my thing is valuable. I'd rather find what they already want and then solve it in a new way. Much better. All right, let's go. Rachel, is that what you're looking at? Or which one are you looking at? >> Yep. >> Rachel? All right. Raquel. All right, maybe it's Raquel, you don't know. Um, mocking Machin Machin Garcia. All right. 21, IO Psych, which I think stands for industrial organizational psychology graduate, drawn to business, which would make sense because you studied industrial organizational psychology. Say that 10 times fast. Uh sold insurance before, not for me, but I love the systems behind the sales. What's a business that I can start and scale to 100,000 a month in profit and where to start? Honestly, there's more businesses that can get to 100,000 a month in profit than ones that don't. I like that you're asking the question, but I would honestly point to you and say what what business can't get to 100,000 a month? TikTok shop, you can get to 100 grand a month. You want to be an influencer? Just make it on ad ad revenue, you can make 100 grand a month. You want to You want to sell merch, you can get to 100 grand a month in profit. You want to You want to start up sell course, 100 grand a month. You want to start a school community, you can get to 100 grand a month. You want to sell insurance, you can get to 100 grand a month. Like all of these businesses get to 100 grand a month. Um and so I think what what what might be helpful for you cuz the thing is is kind of like Mehdi earlier, you're going to have a goal of 100 grand a month and then once you have 100 grand a month, your goal is going to be a million a month. Like it's just what it is, right? Um think a couple steps ahead. Um and I know it sounds unrealistic and unfathomable to you, but it's just like it's going to be really painful to then get there and then be like, "Oh, I should change everything." Um so some of the tried-and-true businesses that exist, industries that have been around 100 years, um taking a more modern approach to an old business is still one of my favorite ways of making money. Um but we live in a digital era. So fundamentally, you're probably going to either need to learn to either do cold outbound, run ads, or make content, and then funnel it towards an offer that you can sell over the phone if you're good at sales, and that would probably be the fastest way. Cuz you said which companies, but the fastest is just sell something expensive to small amount of people for a lot of money. That's basically it. Hopefully that answered. That's the reality of it. Like every business can do it, you just have to pick one. And I would encourage you to pick sooner because you can always pivot. All right. Uh Uh, I'll do one more and then I'm going to do the next question. All right. Sufian Okatu. All right. Hello Alex. I sell SEO services to dentists, but can't guarantee specific ranking within a fixed time frame. How should I phrase and guarantee the offer without making promises I can't control? Okay. Um, I'm going to give you my my honest answer and then I will give you an answer to your question. The honest answer is that I have seen a lot of SEO agencies over the years and I can say almost to a man, the ones that make the most money actually can guarantee those things. Now, part of the guarantee is is a math problem, which is let's say you get 80% of people to an outcome, not 100%. Well, we just have to do the math. So, if you guarantee that, but you sell three times more people because of the guarantee, you'll make more money even if 20% of people don't hit it. Now, of the 20% of people don't hit it, if you move them up in the rankings, they still get leads, they might not care. And so, you can either guarantee around ranking, you can guarantee around traffic, you can guarantee around leads, you can guarantee around sales, you can guarantee around ROI. So, there's a lot of different guarantees that you could do. You could just say, "Listen, by by month six, if you're not making enough sales to cover our uh, you know, the cost of us with SEO, we will keep working for another six months for free." That is a great initial offer for people. Um, if you want to make it have more teeth, you could say, "We'll give you the money back." Uh, you could give it for a longer period of time because the more valuable it like SEO takes longer if you're actually good to make it work and so, you would just push it over a longer period of time. And the contingency around that is that they have to be on time with each other and so, I don't know what your churn is, but let's say it's a 12-month agreement. If they pay all 12 of those months, then they would only then and only then would they be qualified to earn the guarantee. And if someone's been with you for 12 months, the likely that they actually are getting a return is really high. And so, um, it is a bit riskier, but that's the nature of a guarantee is you're shifting risk from the customer to yourself. And so, thing number one is you want to make sure you're actually good at the thing and I'd would like I said, the biggest SEO agencies that I've ever seen are all really good at SEO. You got to be good at making the food, right? We can put all the business stuff around it, but the food's got to be good. It doesn't matter. Underneath of that, there's a lot of different things you can ROI, and you can change the terms of the ROI. You can make it conditional. You can make it over extended periods of time. All of those things that can still make the the offer very compelling. Um without uh and and do math around it, so that it actually is not going to be, "Oh, if I sell 100 people, I might have to give 20 of them back." If you got even 50% of people to a an ROI, you would not refund 50%. I'm just telling you the math. You might refund 10%, but you might get a three or four X in sales because of the offer. And that's fundamentally the the nature of why this is important. All right. Thanks, Rachel. Thanks for thanks thank you. I appreciate that. All right, with that, next caller. Let's Rocky Road, baby. >> Hola, Alex from Spain. >> Hola. Qué tal? >> Y tú? >> Bien. Dime. Qué pasa? >> Hi. I recently moved here from the Boston area, and I decided to diversify my portfolio and open a health restaurant and lifestyle brand here in Spain. So >> Are you in Madrid? >> I am in Valencia. >> Valencia. Okay. >> Yeah, Valencia. So, there's definitely a gap for the health market here, so that's something I definitely jumped on. I saw the location of the space, and then kind of created the business plan after that. >> Okay. >> So, it's like Sweetgreen meets Erewhon, but with a huge Spanish terrace. So, it's been really good. We've had collabs with Porsche, High Rocks, all the wellness brands in Spain. >> Amazing. >> But, we're getting all the things that restaurants have to happen in 1 month. So, we've had a kitchen fire. I've had managers punch my employees in the face. I've had employees say that this is their culture, and they don't like to work hard, and that I'm American. I have too high of expectations. Um the dishwasher can break on the weekend, and it's a Saturday, so they don't work on the weekend, so your dishwasher can't get fixed until Monday. Um the The honestly, it just going on. Every day, it's something. I feel like with my American work ethic, it's super difficult to feel supported in this country. And the shock, I definitely have a high pain tolerance. Um and I feel like I wish that you're saying to my head every day about you can suffer, suffering is normal, it's a part of the process. But I feel like I'm at my end's wit with this. So, my question for you is going to be, given how you talk about how failure and suffering are mandatory for success, where do you draw the line between differentiating that suffering of failure and the suffering that you need to push through to get to that success? >> Great question. Um it's whether you push or you pivot, which is an eternal question for entrepreneurs, which is um somewhat personal, but I would say from an objective perspective, you is there a fundamental assumption of the original business model that has been disproven? If there's no fundamental assumption that underpins how demand and the monetization works, then I would say that things are hard. If it's the wrong kind of hard, which is that like no one's buying the thing, no one like I thought doggie skateboards was going to be a big business and it doesn't turn out to be, that's not one where I push it. So, like I do not try to push where there is no demand. If there is demand and then things suck, that's where we have to just like take it one step at a time and just like breathe and just solve one problem at a time. I'm sorry about the the kitchen fires, that sucks. In terms of the employee punching the other employee, I don't know what they said. We got to you got to hear both sides, you know? What what you know? What did she say? I don't know, right? >> They got knocked out, so you know, it's just another day in the restaurant. >> Yeah. Um I 100% uh recognize the issue with the work ethic piece. I think the way that you should see it is that you're going to have to kiss a lot more toads to find someone who's willing to work. Um it's not that the work ethic there is uh not present, it's just that it's rarer. Uh because it is your right, it is absolutely cultural norm. When I lived in France, which I did, um I I I mean, I can appreciate the country, but I [ __ ] love America. Uh um Um and I was like, this is insane. I get off at work at 5:00 and all stores close at 5:00. How the [ __ ] do you buy anything here? Like >> Can you eat on a Sunday? You can't. >> Yeah, it was ridiculous. I I hated it. I hated everything and I just wanted to go home. Um and so I 100% understand. I was like, all you'd have to do if you want to compete in this country is just be open. That's all you'd have to do. Just be open. >> [laughter] >> Right? Um and so I think you're encountering that. I think what you should look for is that you should be very aggressive in terms of how you're advertising to get employees and then state very clearly um that this is the working environment. This is an American culture. And one of the nice things with American cultures is that we also win. And I think there's going to be a certain percentage and it's to be fair and this is really important. Winning isn't for everyone. It is the nature of winning that is it is exclusionary by definition. And so it means that you'll have to talk to more people in order to find people with winning characteristics and who are attracted to winning behaviors. And so I agree with you that mediocre people in a country that has a mediocre economy just measured by GDP, um you're going to have a higher prevalence of mediocre work work ethic. But I do not think by any means that that represents every person in the country. It just means that you'll have to do more of them. Because what is your alternative right now? >> Me working and working my consulting job to fund it and yeah, doing it all. So that's not possible. >> Right. So you can't really leave right now. Right? So I mean like let's actually walk through the actual doors. Door one is that you could lose your savings, shut it down, right? And then have bankruptcy in Spain. I don't even know how that works, right? But there's some version of that in Spain. That's option one. Um option two is you you know, make it work. All right? Option three is that you sell it at a loss, which is similar to number one, but just you probably recoup something. Um is there like what would you do if you didn't do this? Do you still like the business? Like the idea of the business? >> Yeah. I think playing into like the health factor definitely makes this feel like just a space for me to have like grow my community being a foreigner and having a place where everybody comes and cares about their health, meets for workouts and stuff. So, I do find the passion when I'm able to shift my focus into that, but I feel like my focus is completely on catching up on the next fire of the day, then I'm really losing that. >> Yeah. Um what do you want to do? >> Good question. I don't have a brain today. I think that I want to push through, um but I'm being told by a lot of people that I've endured enough, but >> Woah, okay, hold on. >> to you and I really I know what my answer is. So, I just need some validation. >> Well, let let's this is this is really good. I'm glad you said that. Um the people who told you that you have suffered enough, have those people accomplished the goals that you have want to accomplish? >> One is my business partner, unfortunately. >> Well, that that person is the question was have the people that are telling you that accomplished the goals that you want? >> No, the answer is no, but yeah, it's hard to be in that environment every day and have that in your ear. >> I totally understand. I think that it would be worthwhile for you. So, you have two options there. Either you can not talk about work with those people because they're going to piss on it. Um or you just don't see them in general because they're not helping you. >> Um they're my partner in the project. >> So, it's just this one partner. Well, I mean, the question I mean, this is real, right? This is real. Um I think you have to have a conversation. Like I think you need a real conversation. And so, what's your partner's name? >> Philip. >> Was it? >> Philip. >> Philip. All All got it. Um one of the things that makes So, this is partially addressed to Philip, but also partially addressed to all the other business, you know, partners out there. Um the people who succeed in life are delusional optimists. And part of being a delusional optimist is that you have to ignore reality to some degree, which means that you have to, through a fire, see that things are going to be pure afterwards and we're going to be able to start fresh and we're going to make it exactly the way we want it, right? Uh through an altercation, you're going to be able to, you know, clean house and reset the the cultural standards. Like, whenever, you know, things don't go your way, there's always a narrative that makes it work for you. And so, there's the classic story of the, you know, the the Buddhist, uh you know, the wise men and and and the and the child where, uh you know, hey, uh a baby is born, uh you know, he's going to have a blessed life. The wise man says, "We'll see." And then they, uh you know, buy the kid a horse and they said, uh you know, "We'll see uh whether it's good or bad." Then the kid falls from the horse and they say, "Oh, everything's [ __ ] now." He says, "We'll see." And then the army comes and recruits is going to go recruit the kid, uh but he can't because he has a a bad leg. He says, "We'll see." And so, the issue is that like there's a framing for every single situation that is both positive and negative. And I think the people who are entrepreneurs are able to always frame something that would appear negative to most people as something that is positive or an opportunity, right? And so, you never want to waste a crisis is one of the one of the first rules of marketing. And so, you have a lot of crises. And the thing is that at the end of the day, what story do you want to tell when you're older? Like that you persevered or that you you quit when it got hard. And if you really do believe in the business, like the thing that I have to confront is like, is there a demand? Do people actually like this? Are you making money? And these are one-time expenses, um and they're just emotional inconveniences. Um like would the business be making money if you didn't have these, call it, one-off whatevers? >> Yeah, I definitely feel that I've created a community here. I have some like wallets and I mean cards in your wallet. So, I have about like 100 to 200 regulars that come by three or four times a week, so it's definitely and we're hitting we're on track for about 1.5 million this first year, so >> Are you going to make money? Like outside of the the kitchen fire whatever, but like will the business make money? >> After year one, yeah, we should be netting about 20k a month. >> Okay. Was that something like was making that like a goal that you had? >> This is kind of just like my passion project. I have uh properties and I have my retirement funds completed, so yeah, this is my fun thing. >> Well, if it's a passion project, then you never did it for the money to begin with and so >> Right. >> I mean like beautiful things come from chaos. Like and I don't even think you'd care for it as much if you if it came easy. >> I agree. >> Right? And so like that's what makes things worth doing worth doing is that no one else does them, which is why they're worth doing. >> Amen. >> Right, so I think that there's probably conversation that has to happen with Philip, which is like, "Listen, this is my viewpoint in the world. Um and in order for this project to be successful, we both need to be delusionally opti- optimistic. You've already obviously cracked something cuz you know, you're you're you're you're pacing 1.5 and you're in your first year for a restaurant, really good. Um so like that's first year, like next year it might do three or might do two and a half and if it does that, like you'll be really making money, right? Um and so it's just like I like I would give him instructions on how you would like him to behave. Meaning when bad things happen, I would prefer if you did this instead of this. Like when I like and also it's on you, too, which is that you need to reward him for not being negative. And also, you can't start it. Meaning if you complain, you are starting the cycle. So just stop complaining to him because on some level, you might say those things and then he reinforced that loop with you and then you feel bad afterwards. >> Right. Yeah, I know I'm definitely totally fine with the suffering that I don't feel that I'm complaining. I think it's like an outside view of looking at me and being like, "How does someone do this? Like, I'm Spanish. We take naps. Why are you not napping today?" And it's like "We must persevere." >> Well, yeah, and I think there's probably a conversation there where it's like, "Hey, if you want, like why don't you just go down to being a 25% partner? I'll be 75% you have to worry about it." Like, I think you I think you do need to have a partnership conversation because it's going to become an issue, especially if you have differences. Like, part of the issue you have with the employees is that one of the owners is not modeling what good looks like. Right? So, if they look at the hard working one and the not hard working one, they're going to pick the one the pick the view of the world that they prefer, which is going to be the not hard hard working one. >> Very true. >> Right? So, I do think you need it like I actually don't think you have a business problem. I think you have a partner problem. >> Yeah, definitely. >> Like, did you Did you expect this to be fast, easy, and risk-free? >> Not at all. I know that I am exactly where I'm supposed to be right now. >> Right. And this is what hard feels like. And so, it is exactly what you expected. It's just this is what it feels like and it always feels different for every person. Um and so, I think that you just need to have that conversation with Philip and then you need to look at what next steps look like, which is either like you behave in this way and that is like what we need in order to succeed. And if you don't want to do that, I understand that and let's come up with an exit plan for you. >> Okay. >> Which might mean that like if you put cash into it, that you payment plan him back out almost as like a bank note fundamentally and then you just pay him over 5 years or 3 years or whatever and then he doesn't have to participate in the downside and you're like, "Listen, I'll take all the risk back over, but I get all the upside and that's the trade." Cool? >> Yep. >> All right. >> Perfect. >> Appreciate you. >> Cool. Thank you so much, Alex. >> Ciao. >> Buenas noches. All right. Okay, I'm going to do one or two more le chats or el chats and then uh and then we'll do it. What's up? >> Timing timing is tight, so we'll to one caller and then we'll be 2:30. >> All right, well I'm going to answer one of these, and then we'll do All right, Prism Dev. I am a solo Roblox developer handling coding, art, marketing. How do I identify which task is limiting growth most, and decide whether to automate it, outsource it, or stop doing it entirely? Well, the decision around automation, outsourcing, or stop doing it is is a is a secondary and less important question to how do I identify what is limiting your growth. Um once you identify what is limiting your growth, it then just comes down to how do I allocate all my resources to the point in the business that gets the highest return. And whether you need to do it manually or not is just a question of what your return on those resources are. Like there might be a point like if you had to, you know, sign checks to make a billion dollars, you don't need to automate it. You can just go make a billion dollars. And so I use that as an extreme example to say like only after making sure that something is actually important can we then decide how do we make it even more efficient, aka even have higher leverage than the existing, but by far, the reason that most people are not making money even with all this AI that's out there is that they're working on the wrong [ __ ] and they're just doing stuff that doesn't matter very fast. All right. Last caller. What up? >> Hi. Can you hear me? >> I can hear you. What's cooking? >> Hi. Uh my name is Rowan. So, um I bought a nail salon about 8 months ago. It's located in one of the biggest shopping malls in Austria, Europe. Um this year's projected revenue is around 600k. >> All right. >> My goal is 3 million in the next 2 years at full capacity for this location, and then after that, you know, nail the model, and then open more locations. >> Mhm. >> Uh the average ticket is about 65 euros. Um I have five technicians, including myself. There's room for 10. What I need to fix fast is demand in winter, or slower months, where mall traffic is lower besides December. >> Mhm. >> I basically don't have a money model right now. Um no front end offer, no track channel. Over half of new clients find out about us walking by. >> Mhm. >> Instagram is more than I believed, but I don't post at volume standards, so not very surprised there. >> Okay. >> Um retention is being fixed right now with my receptionist only ban fam, asking for reviews, getting content and everything. >> Okay, that's good. >> So, my question my question is basically if this was your studio, what front end offer and acquisition acquisition model would you run to fill um the slower months or basically all the whole year? >> Mhm. I'd probably run a giveaway. >> Uh on that, I rebranded 2 months ago and I made a giveaway actually >> Mhm. >> from the money models book. >> Yeah, what did you give away? >> Uh a full year of service. >> Okay. >> Off nails. >> Got it. >> Um 2,000 euros uh worth. >> Yeah. >> Um it it was pretty successful. >> Yeah. >> But um I haven't really I don't really have had Sorry. I haven't had the back end yet to capture all of that demand or attention. So, people signed up. I offered them, you know, 50% off basically off their main main price. >> Yeah, as the second place offer, is that what you're saying? >> Exactly. Exactly. But I didn't have the receptionist at that time. >> Yeah. >> So, when people came in, I didn't do ban fam or, you know, upsell them to the company idea and everything, so that was a missed opportunity, yeah. >> Okay. Well, what are your what are your uh call it ascension and retention rates now compared to then? >> Well, I didn't really have tracking attribution at that point. I just hired the receptionist this month. So, what I have from, you know, just the the the calendar the >> Yeah. >> uh software. So, >> I'm going to cut you off. Yeah, I'm just going to cut you off cuz I'm pretty sure it was just better than it was before, right? >> Yeah. >> Okay, got it. So, if you redid the math on the first the first uh giveaway, if you had the same LTV that you have now that you fixed the back end, would it have been even more profitable than it was? >> Of course. >> Okay, then just run it again, dude. >> Okay. >> That's it. Just run it again. >> Yeah. Um so, I have a question about that because I was at a marketing workshop and attorney actually told me he likes to to run, you know, a front end like $139 offer, you know, two two visits and then roll that into continuity. >> Sure. >> Would you think that's better to market or just to give away is just what's the best? >> It doesn't matter, man. Like so so I you're you're asking a question that the market will answer for you the moment you run the ads. So, I cannot tell you which offer will out convert. I can tell you that giveaways do really well and they already did even though you didn't even have a back end, it still worked, which is like pretty good, you know, data for you. >> Um >> But fundamentally, you're just going to make the offer, run it to a landing page, and then probably have automated follow-up and scheduling, and then as soon as you have a good attach rate from the people who come into the nail salon getting on the continuity. Like, that's probably all you're going to need and you can run like if you have two front end promotions to your point, like if I gave you a different front end promotion, just alternate them. Just do one one month and do the other one the next month. Like very simple. Like the more front end offers you have that convert, the better cuz it just gives you more more variety in the in in the marketing, especially in a local market. Um But the thing is is that no one knows you exist. So, we have this big fear of like I don't want to saturate the market. Like dude, no one even knows that you are here." So, um you can either alternate them or you can just run it until the wheels come off. Both of them work. It doesn't really matter. It's just what's LTV to CAC. If both of them are profitable, run them. >> Uh-huh. Okay. Um so, the next question is uh you talked and even I talked about you were looking to buy a nail salon chain. >> Yeah. >> So, would you mind telling me a bit more about that? Like, what's worse, the money model, the comp structure, and everything like that? >> The biggest thing that separates the businesses that you have like from some other businesses that you have low-skilled labor, right? Nail techs. And so, the big problem with your business um and businesses like yours is that people become very loyal to the nail techs and less so to the business. And so, if the nail tech leaves because their book gets full enough, they just do the math and they say, "Hey, I could just do this on my own and not have to pay a split or whatever to the store, right?" >> Yeah. >> And so, in order for your business to be successful long-term, and that's what the the the chain that I was looking at had nailed, was that they had figured out uh a very elegant career path for nail techs to make like 70,000 plus per year. Now, it took obviously time for them to do that. It might take two or three years and have to do certain amount of nail jobs in order to level up in the in the level and type of nails that they can do. But, every X amount of you know, nail sessions they ran, they would qualify to learn another more valuable skill set so they could upsell that and then make more money per hour. And then, as they develop more skills, uh they can sell at higher ticket and basically their hourly would continue to get up go up and so too with their split. And so, you have to be able to paint that career path so that it's it's you don't need to you don't want to make it hard for people to leave. You want to make it easy for them to stay. >> Right. >> And that's going to be the big issue. I'm just telling you right now. Like, I actually don't think like finding demand for nail salons is not a problem. It's like finding demand for cleaning. It's it's it's very easy to find people who want their houses cleaned. It's very hard to find labor that is willing to clean houses well, not you know, not steal, speak English, blah blah blah blah blah, at least in the US, right? And so you were in the same type of business, which means that your true model is going to be around talent retention. Like the you know, the front ends for your business is not going to be difficult. You should have pretty exceptional lead to be to CAC, um especially if you're following the stuff that we're outlining, which it seems like you are and and you know, you've improved it. Um but long term you need to a talent model so that uh people can continue to make more money and then eventually is the goal, you can put people into the new locations where they become managers and they can get, you know, 5 or 10% of the profit. Now, to be clear, I'm not saying they're going to be an owner, they could be owner-like. Does that make sense? >> Yeah, yeah. Uh basically I know already all of this long term, yeah, but I didn't really know how to fix the short term to you know, even survive through the slower months because yeah, my basic limiting belief still till now was my entire family owns nail salons actually in Germany. Um they say always like, you know, winter and slow months and everything, you got to just survive and then like and and when Ed told me that this isn't a seasonal business, it just broke everything. It shattered my, you know, belief and but I still didn't know how to do it. So >> You have to generate demand. That's all it was. You ran a giveaway play, you didn't have a back end, you need to run it again. Like there's enough people in Germany or in your area to fill your one nail salon up. And so what you want to do is make everybody else who has a nail salon feel like winter is a bad season, but for you it's always hunting season. >> Right. >> If you know how to generate demand, things are not seasonal. Think about that for a second. If you know how to generate demand profitably, you're never seasonal. You're always at a supply capacity. >> Yeah. That's true. >> And Steven Queen, it's Austria, not Germany. No one gives a [ __ ] All right, the point is is that the country like nail salons work like nail salons. >> Yeah. Yeah, my my time is 10 times higher than I can handle even at full capacity, so >> So, let's go get that. Go bring them in. Make it rain. >> Yeah. >> All right, brother. Appreciate you. >> Thank you very much. Thank you. >> All right, my people. Happy uh what day is today? Tuesday? >> Tuesday. >> Happy Tuesday. Hopefully you enjoyed the second of our 30-day experiment on uh going live every day. And we made a couple tweaks from yesterday to today, and I think they were favorable. I think they were good. If you guys like this, you know, tell us. If you don't, we're still probably going to do it for the next 30 days, so you just deal. Uh Either way, uh if you're curious, some of these callers came in from Vantage, which is our uh our group for million-dollar plus business owners. Um and so, if you are in that in that bucket, you can uh check it out. I'm sure there's a link somewhere. Um and go see it. And uh that's when you heard him say like I talked to Ed. Um Ed's one of our guys on our team who's helping him with the offer. And so, yeah, if you're stuck not growing as fast as you want, happy to help. Otherwise, hope you enjoyed the show. And I'll see you guys on the next one. Bye.